video gaps

[dmi7b5]

I want to use iCam as part of a security system.  I have been comparing iCam to another app (jumicam), by connecting over my home network, and the other app is providing almost completely smooth, almost instant video update, whereas the iCam video is considerably more delayed, and there are large gaps (Is this what is called "dropped frames"?).  I'm not concerned about resolution or quality of the video.  I just need to be able to distinguish a cat from a person.  What happens now, when I view on my iphone, through iCam is this:  If someone walks across the camera's field of view, on my iphone,  I typically see nothing, but if they they go very slow, a leg or torso might appear, floating in the middle of the room and then quickly vanish. As I said, this doesn't happen with the other app.

I would like to figure out a way to improve the video because iCam is perfect for my circumstance in every other way (push notification of motion events, ability to activate and deactivate remotely, audio, multiple cameras...).  The other app doesn't do any of these, just the video.  I think I may be asking for contradictory things, though, since increasing the frame rate may be the only solution, but this would only make the problem worse, correct?

Nevertheless, I figured I would ask because the other app seems to be doing something different with the video since I'm able to see it live, without much delay, and without any gaps.  If there is something I could do differently, I'm all ears.  Lower resolution webcam, for instance?  I've already tried turning off audio in iCam Source, in order to reduce the amount of data being sent, but it didn't make any difference in the video gaps.

Thanks

iPhone 3G with OS4 (will be upgrading to iPhone 4 soon)
Windows XP, latest service pack
Pentium 4, (dual 3 Ghz), 2 GB RAM
Logitech Webcam Pro 9000
Linksys WRT54G wireless router

[Jay]

The two things that can effect the framerate are the CPU speed of the computer running iCamSource and the bandwidth available to the computer and the iPhone/iPod.  If iCamSource is using a lot of CPU % on your computer (>50%), the processing might be causing a slowdown.

Does the video appear slow in iCamSource on the computer as well?  The framerate in iCamSource is determined by the camera.

The video will always be slower on the iPhone than on the computer due to bandwidth limitations.

On local Wi-Fi, you should see a few frames per second.
On a remote Wi-Fi hot spot, you should see about a frame per second.
On 3G, Apple requires us to keep the framerate less than 1 frame every 2 seconds.  If it's a poor 3G connection, it may be slower.
On EDGE, you'll probably see about one frame every 5 seconds or so, or as low as 1 frame every 10 seconds if you have a poor EDGE signal.

If the framerate you're seeing is significantly lower than that, please let me know what framerate you are seeing and what connection type you're using.

[dmi7b5]

Thanks for the reply.  Picture is clear and and shows no delay viewed on computer.  iCam source utilizes about 30% of resources.  If I stand in front of of the camera, looking at my iphone on 5 bars 3g connection, the delay is about 20 seconds.  I have a lousy satellite connection (Hughesnet) which rarely (never) supplies advertised speed of 1.6 mbps download.  Just now tested and upload speed is 0.13 mbps, while download was 0.50 mbps.  Nevertheless, when I got fairly good live video on the other app, I thought there might be something specific to iCam I could change. 

So, here's where I am now:  Since I posted this thread, I've adjusted my expectations.  I suspect that my poor internet connection is too a big a limitation.  I've pretty much given up on the idea of live video feed, and I don't actually even need it.  What I want is motion detection, notification, the ability to remotely view recorded pictures of the detected motion, and finally, the most convenient feature, offered only by iCam, as far as I can find, is the ability to enable and disable recording and notifications from my iphone.

But...after saying all that, I actually have a new problem.  Two days ago, I checked everything out and it worked fabulously.  I was able to connect to two cameras on two separate computers on my home network, OR two cameras on the same computer.  No issues whatsoever, except the delay mentioned above.  As of yesterday morning, I would get source connection error every other time I would try to connect via my iphone (on either wifi or 3g).  As of yesterday afternoon, attempting to connect with more than one camera immediately crashes iCam Source (I get connection error, then I go to the computer and see iCam Source has crashed).  I managed to get things back to the point that I could connect to a single camera attached to one of my computers.

I'm using the latest beta of source (1.4.2.6), but NOT checking the box to automatically open a port works, while checking the box seems to cause problems.  I have uPnp enabled on my router, but I haven't explored manually forwarding yet. Since I am able to connect to a single camera on both 3g and wifi, I'm assuming this means that the problem is probably something other than port forwarding.  I've tried disabling my firewall, and shutting off any programs that have anything to do with internet.

I'd really like to have multiple cameras. If you have any ideas what might be causing the source connection error and subsequent crash when attempting to connect to more than one computer on my network (each with a camera), I will investigate further. 

[OUAnthony]

I had very similar issues to you...could view 1 camera ok, but icamsource for the other camera would crash (or some other weird variation). Once I set up manual port forwarding, all of those problems went away. Just make sure your computers have static IP addresses within your LAN and check the port forwarding box in each icamsource...setting each one to a different range of ports (I think the recommendation is 6 ports per icamsource)...and finally forwards each of those port ranges to the appropriate computer IP within your LAN in your router settings. Definitely verify that the ports are open...because firewalls and/or typos in the router settings could lead you to the same problems you had before attempting the port forwarding. Once I got it all set up correctly, icamsource has not crashed once (on a XP machine).

As far as uPNP goes, someone else said they had some issues getting the uPNP feature to work with multiple instances of icamsource trying to control it...but rebooting the router fixed those problems (if I remember correctly). That might be worth trying...before doing all of that messy manual port forwarding.

I would try to negotiate a lower monthly bill with your ISP (or ask them to bump you up in bandwidth with no extra cost). Granted, it is difficult to accurately measure download/upload speeds, as other Internet traffic can have a big impact on your apparent download/upload speeds. The download/upload server would really need to be within your ISP's network to get an accurate speed. With that being said, your download/upload rates do seem really bad. At least get their tech support to test the connection!

[dmi7b5]

Hi, thanks.  Well, I guess I'll investigate port forwarding and setting up static ips.  Frankly, I almost always end up making a stupid mistake when I'm doing that sort of stuff, and I don't discover it until I've been at it for 17 hours.  I still wake up with nightmares over setting up my wireless network with security.  The suggestion to try rebooting the router is a good one.  Thanks.  As for Hughesnet, I do plan to complain, but, based upon what I've seen, they are well aware that they aren't delivering what they promise.  There is a class action in CA right now, I believe. 

I hope to follow up with good news...

[OUAnthony]

If you run into trouble, let me know. The settings were trickier than setting up wireless security. Worst-case senario, you can allow someone to remotely connect and enter the settings for you.

[dmi7b5]

Ok, well, I did a bunch of stuff and none of it worked.  I'm not especially tech savvy, but it seemed weird that I could not forward ports.  So I googled port forwarding and hughesnet.  I don't completely understand what I read, but there's a slew of other people with the same frustration.  it did seem clear enough that the modem hughesnet supplies is the problem.  That is, it is unconfigurable, and I think it somehow renders anything I do with my Linksys router irrelevant. In any case, this whole thing was really just a "nice to have" sort of deal.  I'm going to rethink this and just set up some cameras that sense motion, take pictures, and email them to me.  I suspect I will be able to do that pretty easily.  Thanks for the offer of remote assist, but I think this is where I refocus my efforts.

[OUAnthony]

Yeah, I just read up on your problem. Hmm, I must say that Hughesnet sucks. lol From your problems, I'm guessing that you have a dynamic IP address (one that changes occassionally), as it seems you are unable to configure port forwarding in your POS Hughesnet modem. Unfortunately, it seems the only alternative for you is to pay extra for a static IP address...at least based on other people's problems. Right now, your Linksys has DHCP disabled (required by Hughesnet)...so your router is really just acting as a network switch. It can't forward any ports, the uPNP feature won't work, etc. Actually you could probably configure your router using your current IP address...but you would have to update your router settings everytime Hughesnet assigned you a new IP. Until you updated it, you would lose Internet on any computer connected through the router. But if you just wanted to play with it and see if it'd be worth upgrading to a static IP, that might work for you temporarily. Is Hughesnet your only option for high-speed Internet? No cable or DSL companies in your area?

Regardless of what you decide on the above and the iCam app, you can still use icamsource on your computer to monitor your cameras and record motion. It should even send you motion notifications via push to your iCam app....that does work, right? You just wouldn't want to attempt to connect to/view the cameras when not on your local network. Or you could uninstall the iCam app from your phone and not receive notifications...but the motion detection/recording would still continue to function on your computer as long as you keep icamsource running. Further, you could download/install Dropbox (free offsite backup of files) and use it to constantly backup your motion images offsite (in case someone steals your computer). If you go this route, just make sure that you change the recording directory for icamsource so that it is located within the dropbox backup directory...do that for all instances of icamsource. If you keep the iCam app to reeive push notifications, you can also install Dropbox's iPhone app to vie the new image uploads. This should be more dependable and faster than e-mailed images...and you see multiple images quickly via the dropbox app. E-mail servers can be overwhelmed and undependable at times...just FYI. If you go the dropbox route, make sure that your user account on your computer is password protected...and that the screenlocks when you leave...that way nobody has a way of getting into your dropbox account. Granted, I doubt most thieves would ever think about that.

[dmi7b5]

Yeah, Hughesnet sucks.  Not only that, but you pay $500 up front for the equipment and installation, and then you are committed to a 2 year contract. I used to complain sometimes about Comcast, when we lived somewhere else.  I didn't know how good I had it.  Unfortunately, we have no other options (rural). 

But I digress...

The Dropbox solution works perfectly:  I run multiple cameras, get instant notification, and then log in to Dropbox and get the photos, which are even automatically set up as thumbnails, so I can just go right to the one I want.  And on top of all that, I realized that I don't need to give up the convenience of being able to enable and disable as I'm getting in an out of my car, because, if I'm in the driveway, my wifi automatically connects and I can use iCam to log in.  Perfect!  It took me three days of head scratching, but now I have a security system with all the features I wanted, and I only had to buy two apps and a USB extension cable.

Thank you!

[OUAnthony]

I know it's not quite as simple as using 1 app...but it's probably worth the hassle to save the extra $20/month that Hughesnet would charge you for a static IP address....and you'd probably still be hindered by extra-slow download/upload speeds...so I'm still thinking your experience using the iCam app wouldn't be the full experience that those of us with true high-speed Internet enjoy. Sorry, not trying to rub it in...I feel sorry for you. After reading several discussion boards, I am 200% sure that I NEVER want to have Hughesnet as my provider.

I use dropbox too (just for backup), and I'm glad it's free. Personally, I think everyone who is using iCam should use dropbox or some equivalent...it's so easy to use and if you have a semi-decent computer, you can't even tell it's running. Of course, you can also have dropbox back up other important files offsite too...not just iCam images. Great peace of mind if someone steals the computer or your harddrive crashes, etc. Anyway, I'm glad you have something usable now!

[Wooslini]

I get the same issue with iCam.  I just bought it earlier and while it does seem pretty cool, I am already regretting a bit spending the money.  Excellent quality for the thick client on my PC but horrible quality on my iPhone/iPad.  Going to fullscreen mode and I barely get half a frame per second.

I know for certain that it has nothing to do with CPU Usage nor Bandwidth, as was brought up in this thread, because I work with computers and bandwidth for a living lol.

Currently, I get about 30mb down and 2.5 up which is MUCH higher than the average person.  My iPhone and iPad are both sitting about 4 feet away from my router so the WiFi connection could not be faster.  PC is running a 3.1 dual core processor at about 5% usage.  Logitech QuickCam Pro 9000 Webcam is updated to the latest drivers and optimized.  Video on both the iPhone and iPad are choppy and slow.

Any other things I may try?

[Stefan]

I have a Logitech QuickCam Pro 9000 as well running on Windows 7 in Parallels on an older Mac Pro ... Running iCamSource 1.4.2.6 and I see probably around at least 3-5 frames a second over local WiFi on my iPhone and iPad when zoomed in. Is your WiFi network particularly busy with other traffic? Have you tried rebooting your router? Your internet bandwidth connection shouldn't have an effect on iCam's performance over local WiFi.

When you say your webcam is updated to the latest drivers and "optimized" ... What does that mean, specifically?

[Wooslini]

WiFi network has no other traffic on it at the moment.  By "optimized" I mean that I have it set on low resolution and compression rate is increased.  Yes, I have rebooted my router and speedtested it.

[Stefan]

I have updated to the latest drivers and software, and even when adjust the video preferences of the webcam I still see at least a few frames a second.

What version of the iCamSource are you running?

[dmi7b5]

I'm the OP.  Just wanted to follow up to say that a couple days ago I moved some things around with my network because I was having wireless problems.  I added hard wiring, and to make a long story short, I logged on to icam via 3g today, and it worked.  It's not super fast, but it is working.  I'm not prepared to retract all the bad things I said about Hughesnet,  but I think at least some of the problem was with my router.