Author Topic: URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!  (Read 28499 times)

sev

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URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!
« on: October 30, 2013, 12:09:09 AM »
DO NOT UPDATE TO THE LATEST FOSCAM 8910W FIRMWARE!!!

Changes made (see below for changelog) them ruined my iCam setup. Nothing else was changed.
Now all I get is "401 Webcam authorization failure" :( 

Developer, please help! :(  I  cannot downgrade foscam firmware to lower version.  It sucks I wish I had known this before updating.  I updated due to keep up with security vulnerabilities

I have three (3) Foscam 8910W with following settings: http://192.168.1.***:****/video.cgi  (MJPEG)
Changelog:
Quote
1) Fix the CSRF security vulnerabilities;
2) Encrypt all the username and password with MD5;
3) Update the ActiveX version to 0.0.0.46;
4) Add promption if the disk for video recording is full.

SKJM Support

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Re: URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!
« Reply #1 on: October 30, 2013, 06:59:35 PM »
Are you able to see a feed from your cameras via your web browser?

sev

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Re: URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!
« Reply #2 on: October 30, 2013, 07:00:57 PM »
Yes, perfectly. It's from the iCam end and it happened directly after firmware update. :(

What can I do to help fix this.  I love iCam and rely it so much. A lot of people will be having this problem soon once they update

sev

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Re: URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!
« Reply #3 on: October 30, 2013, 07:26:13 PM »
Also, one thing to note -- the login style has changed for new firmware.

It used to be http auth prompt (seperate window), but now it's a user/pass in a website style. Here's pic

SKJM Support

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Re: URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!
« Reply #4 on: October 31, 2013, 03:26:38 PM »
Unfortunately our Foscam cameras are older models and cannot be upgraded to the latest firmware that contains the new MD5 authentication. Is there a way to change the authentication type under the new firmware?

sev

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Re: URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!
« Reply #5 on: October 31, 2013, 05:45:05 PM »
No there is no setting.  What can we do to help you.  The 8910W is one of (if not THE) most popular security camera on amazon. Surely, people will have same problem.

sev

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Re: URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!
« Reply #6 on: November 01, 2013, 02:24:32 AM »
So it begins...

http://foscam.us/forum/latest-firmware-54-on-fi8910w-breaks-login-t7585.html



Other people having same problem it seems.

sev

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Re: URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!
« Reply #7 on: November 01, 2013, 02:29:53 AM »
OKAY, here is the problem developer!!

(quoted from previous thread here: http://foscam.us/forum/latest-firmware-54-on-fi8910w-breaks-login-t7585.html)

I just confirmed that an app called Foscam Pro works. It specifically calls out a recent addition of MD5 for 89XX cameras so that was it.

Other program developer fixed it, so I am assuming it is a very fixable thing


Foscam pro: https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/foscam-pro-two-way-audio-recording/id509546027?mt=8
Quote
MD5 authentication for new 89XX firmware.

Stefan

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Re: URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!
« Reply #8 on: November 01, 2013, 07:41:54 AM »
In order to determine what needs to be changed and test any changes that we make, we would need to connect to a camera with the new firmware.

Foscam's own Live Demo FI8910W seems to still use the old firmware (11.37.2.52 instead of 11.37.2.54) with the standard method of authentication: http://foscam.us/live_demo

If a user has a camera with the new firmware that would be willing to configure it with a temporary login and password and let us connect to it, we can then see what needs to be changed in the iCamSource to support it.

(Just be sure that you have forwarded the appropriate port in your router to allow it to be connected to from outside of your local network.)

Please e-mail the camera's connection information (external IP address and port, login, password) to support@skjm.com and we will see what we can do to support this new firmware.

TheUberOverLord

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Re: URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!
« Reply #9 on: November 01, 2013, 10:38:25 AM »
There is a Foscam FI8910W that IS using this version of firmware that is a public Foscam Demo camera:

Please do a search on "Foscam demo" look for com not us results. Then choose the FI8910W demo camera, located there.

Note: Your forum would not allow me to make a forum link to where the Foscam demo camera is located for the
FI8910W demo camera with the latest firmware version of x.x.x.54

IMHO. Third party software developers NEED to be proactive and keep "In Touch" with the camera manufacturers that they create software for. Camera owners should NOT be required to inform third party software suppliers of changes, when those developer can be informed via the manufacturers. This also places a large burden on the support forums for those manufacturers, who are also burdened in answering questions on "Why" this or that third party software, no longer works. Plus, it does NOT help the overall reputation of that third party software. When doing so.

Also, any camera owner who delays installing these latest Foscam firmware releases, due to trying to NOT cause issues with your application(s) and those cameras. Will be exposed to some security issues during that delay. Which is NOT good for those camera owners, who could have their cameras exploited, while waiting for your fixes.

I know this, because I am a moderator, in the Foscam community Forums.

Additionally. In this case, there was little effort made, to locate a Foscam demo camera, that could be used for testing that in fact has this version of firmware. Once again, placing the burden on camera owners, as well as myself, instead.

One can always post in the Foscam community forum to ask if a Foscam Demo camera is presently available for a specific camera model that has a specific version of firmware or contact Foscam using many different methods, to do same vs. Placing this burden on camera owners, first.

The reason "WHY" this upsets me as it does. Is because myself and others, in the Foscam community forum, will be "Stuck" answering camera owners questions about this issue, until you resolve this issue. Which could be many days or weeks before all versions of your application are changed and published. Even afterwards, it may require those camera owners be informed by others, including myself. That there is NOW a new version of your application, that is available, that fixes, this issue.

Please also note. This new Foscam firmware release, covers virtually "ALL" Foscam MJPEG based camera models. Which means that ANY Foscam camera owner who has upgraded their firmware for their MJPEG based cameras. WILL encounter this issue with your applications, as they are today. Hopefully, this will allow you to visualize, the extent of this problem and how many posts will be required to be answered, in the Foscam community forum, until this issue is resolved by you.

Please contact Foscam ASAP and ask that you can be "In the loop", as many developers have done, when changes like this take place in the future.

Since it's possible that not all Foscam based MJPEG camera owners who use your application, will upgrade to this firmware and future firmware releases. For their Foscam based MJPEG cameras. You will need to query the "get_status.cgi" to determine what the current version of firmware is for a specific camera. This will allow you to parse the system firmware version to determine how your logon to a specific camera, should be formatted. You could also create a option for your application to enable/disable this new feature.

If you don't implement this check/new option, as part of your fix, then you could make your application, non-functional, for Foscam camera owners, who had no issues with your application and their Foscam cameras, prior to making your changes.

Just trying to avoid another round of this issue taking place, in the near future. When you implement any changes.

Thanks.

Don
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 03:00:34 PM by TheUberOverLord »

Stefan

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Re: URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!
« Reply #10 on: November 01, 2013, 03:11:43 PM »
Thank you, Don, for letting us know about the demo camera.

It looks like the new firmware will support the following MJPEG URL that is compatible with the iCamSource: http://IP:PORT/videostream.cgi?user=USERNAME&pwd=PASSWORD

Instead of entering the camera's login and password into the iCamSource, they are now included in the URL itself. Just replace IP, PORT, USERNAME, and PASSWORD with the appropriate value for your camera.

The Pan-Tilt and audio functionalities likely will not work, however, so that will be something we will need to change in the iCamSource to support.

As for the rest of your post saying that it is our responsibility to keep "in touch" with every IP camera manufacturer out there (we are aware of more than a hundred in our IP camera database) so that they can let us know when they are going to break an existing functionality in their cameras ... Well, I think that your position as a Foscam Community Forum Moderator gives you quite a different perspective than we have on the matter.

TheUberOverLord

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Re: URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!
« Reply #11 on: November 01, 2013, 03:21:36 PM »
Thank you, Don, for letting us know about the demo camera.

It looks like the new firmware will support the following MJPEG URL that is compatible with the iCamSource: http://IP:PORT/videostream.cgi?user=USERNAME&pwd=PASSWORD

Instead of entering the camera's login and password into the iCamSource, they are now included in the URL itself. Just replace IP, PORT, USERNAME, and PASSWORD with the appropriate value for your camera.

The Pan-Tilt and audio functionalities likely will not work, however, so that will be something we will need to change in the iCamSource to support.

As for the rest of your post saying that it is our responsibility to keep "in touch" with every IP camera manufacturer out there (we are aware of more than a hundred in our IP camera database) so that they can let us know when they are going to break an existing functionality in their cameras ... Well, I think that your position as a Foscam Community Forum Moderator gives you quite a different perspective than we have on the matter.
You are very welcome.

I can only say, that I don't enjoy donating my time, as I do as a free resource, in the Foscam community forum. To answering questions about third party application issues, that could have been avoided easily, when I could instead be helping camera owners with other issues. Doing so, also has no positive benefits to your application(s) reputation, which only potentially harms future sales.

I am and have been, a systems programmer consultant, for over 43 years now. I am and have been a third party developer, for many decades as well. Including Foscam interfaces, as well as many others, over the years.

If you have any doubts about my background? Since I currently am not allowed to include links in my posts here. I can only suggest that you do a Google search on "TheUberOverLord" without the double quotes and then clicking on the togetherweserved link shown, for more details about me.

IMHO. When anyone takes money for a third party application, they should also be responsible enough, to ask to receive an email by any manufacturer, when changes like this are made, that could impact their application. In this case, that option, is and was available. No "busy work" was required, minus requesting to be on a manufacturers email list, once. This is SOP ("Standard Operating Procedure") really, Developer 101. Most IP Camera manufacturers, like Foscam. Have email lists, that you can request to be added to, as a third party developer, so that when changes like these take place. You will know about them ahead of time and have time to test any modifications you make as well.

I suggest making requests like this, because over time. Camera owners will and do start trash-talking third party software when they become angry enough. In most cases, posts like these are not deleted and remain in forums, like the Foscam community forum. If the poster controls their language, which again, does your application no good, now or in the future.

So my feelings about this issue, are not simply based on being a Foscam "Community" moderator. They are based on my experience, as well as being a developer of several different applications for several hundred's of manufacturers, for a very long time.

Don
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 04:18:35 PM by TheUberOverLord »

sev

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Re: URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!
« Reply #12 on: November 01, 2013, 05:47:22 PM »
Quote
As for the rest of your post saying that it is our responsibility to keep "in touch" with every IP camera manufacturer out there (we are aware of more than a hundred in our IP camera database) so that they can let us know when they are going to break an existing functionality in their cameras ... Well, I think that your position as a Foscam Community Forum Moderator gives you quite a different perspective than we have on the matter.

This.

Don, I appreciate your tempered and tactful response, but don't you think a simple email to the developers of these apps would have been helpful to warn them of potential breakage?  I suppose that's where my frustration came in.

sev

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Re: URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!
« Reply #13 on: November 01, 2013, 06:19:44 PM »
Stefan/iCam Dev,

Thank you for the temp fix! It works so far.  Is there any way to asterisk out the password?  As of now anyone can see my iCam password. This really isn't a big deal (at least it works!!), but would be great if we could get more security in protecting password.


TheUberOverLord

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Re: URGENT: Foscam 8910W FW 11.37.2.54/2.4.10.7 breaks iCAM!!!
« Reply #14 on: November 01, 2013, 06:36:53 PM »
Quote
As for the rest of your post saying that it is our responsibility to keep "in touch" with every IP camera manufacturer out there (we are aware of more than a hundred in our IP camera database) so that they can let us know when they are going to break an existing functionality in their cameras ... Well, I think that your position as a Foscam Community Forum Moderator gives you quite a different perspective than we have on the matter.

This.

Don, I appreciate your tempered and tactful response, but don't you think a simple email to the developers of these apps would have been helpful to warn them of potential breakage?  I suppose that's where my frustration came in.

It's important to understand. That the SDKs ("Software Developer Kits") provided by Foscam are in the public domain. Because of this. Foscam really has no idea, whatsoever, as to whom has or will create an application for Foscam cameras. It has always been this way for many years. So it's impossible for Foscam, to auto-add any email address, to a email list of developers, who should or want to be informed of any major changes, by Foscam.

Maybe I am "Old School" but ALL developers that charge money for their third party applications, who care about their customer base, that I know. Take the extra step of contacting any and all manufacturers which their applications are sold to work with, to their paying customers of those applications. So that situations like this can be avoided.

IMHO. This is the only correct approach. To do otherwise, places a heavy burden on others, as well as creates undue damage to your current customer base and for future sales of said application.

Again, IMHO the number of manufacturers an application can interface to, should never be an excuse to not attempt to get on these manufacturers mailing lists for developers to be informed of major changes by those manufacturers.

I wish I could post links in this forum currently to better help explain this, but currently I am not allowed to because I am new to this forum.

This new Foscam firmware is VERY important to install ASAP. As I have mentioned to you, in the Foscam forum. Foscam MJPEG based camera owners who might delay installing that firmware because of issues they might have with this application are running a risk of having their cameras exploited, while waiting.

Again. While you are worried about the Foscam FI8910W camera model. All Foscam MJPEG based camera models will have issues with this application, when they install the most current firmware for their Foscam MJPEG based camera models, until this issue is resolved. So this issue will continue to be reported and grow as other camera owners realize, that their cameras will not work once they have installed this latest Foscam firmware, in their Foscam MJPEG based cameras. With this application.

Worse case. If a camera owner does not install the most current firmware for their Foscam camera. Those cameras could be exploited where email, FTP and DDNS passwords could be gathered. So, each camera owner has to decide what the acceptable risk is. This is why delaying installing this latest firmware while waiting for a fix for this application, might not be the best choice. For every camera owner.

It's because of this, that personally, I think developers should use due diligence, to avoid ever placing camera owners in a position like this one, when possible. Especially more so, when those applications are at cost, to camera owners. All this said. The same due diligence applies to virtually any third party application, not only camera applications.

Don
« Last Edit: November 01, 2013, 07:45:19 PM by TheUberOverLord »