Author Topic: bandwidth  (Read 14013 times)

antipro

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bandwidth
« on: March 09, 2011, 04:37:59 PM »
i have a problem with icam on the iphone.
when i select the main screen with 4 cam the bandwidth sent to the phone via wifi is near to 148kB/s and i see 2 webcams with good fps.

the problem is when i select one of them, i see the image fit the screen but the fps drops drammatically with many freezes.

the bandwidth also drop down from 150kb/s to a poor 30kb/s.

at least via wifi i expect to see fluid images.

what's the problem?

i also noticed just now that via 3G the bandwidth sent is very poor, something like oscillating from 5kb/s to 20kb or less. is normal? i expect to see all my upload bandwidth available used.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2011, 06:38:03 PM by antipro »

Jay

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Re: bandwidth
« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2011, 11:27:00 AM »
Does the video appear slow in iCamSource on the computer as well?  The framerate in iCamSource is determined by the camera.

On local Wi-Fi, you should see a few frames per second.
On a remote Wi-Fi hot spot, you should see about a frame per second.
On 3G, Apple requires us to keep the framerate less than 1 frame every 2 seconds (0.5 fps).  This has been the limit since iCam was first released.
On EDGE, you'll probably see about one frame every 5 seconds or so, or as low as 1 frame every 10 seconds if you have a poor EDGE signal.

If the framerate you're seeing is significantly lower than that, please let me know what framerate you are seeing and what connection type you're using.

antipro

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Re: bandwidth
« Reply #2 on: March 10, 2011, 12:03:18 PM »
Does the video appear slow in iCamSource on the computer as well?  The framerate in iCamSource is determined by the camera.

The video in icamsource appear normal 30fps.

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On local Wi-Fi, you should see a few frames per second.

on local wifi, like i said, i have the mosaic view with 30fps and 150kb/s BUT, when select a webcam, both the fps and the bandwidth drop down and i see many freezes and very poor fps.
this is the real problem, i cant understand why, isnt it strange?

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On a remote Wi-Fi hot spot, you should see about a frame per second.

well, of course i have a poor upload band, only 30kB/s, but i expect to see more than 1fps. i will test better later, need to find a remote wifi.

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On 3G, Apple requires us to keep the framerate less than 1 frame every 2 seconds (0.5 fps).  This has been the limit since iCam was first released.

can i ask why of this limitation?

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On EDGE, you'll probably see about one frame every 5 seconds or so, or as low as 1 frame every 10 seconds if you have a poor EDGE signal.

on edge i expect nothing, i dont even try.

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If the framerate you're seeing is significantly lower than that, please let me know what framerate you are seeing and what connection type you're using.

I will test again and will report here if i'll find something strange.
btw fps arent shown in the display, i can only estimate them.
I am using a normal ADSL 1  4832 kbps / 320 kbps.
thanks
« Last Edit: March 10, 2011, 12:04:51 PM by antipro »

Jay

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Re: bandwidth
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2011, 09:16:04 PM »
When you say it freezes, do you mean it locks up, or is it just jerky?

What are the specs of your computer (CPU, RAM, etc.)?  It's possible that resizing to the larger fullscreen image is requiring more processing.

We have seen cases in the past where the framerate was slowed by third party software that had hijacked the JPEG encoding functions from the operating system.  Do you have any sort of image or video encoding software installed on your computer?  The encoding software that we've seen the problem with before was ffdshow and calibratedQ XD Decode, but there are probably other similar products that do the same thing.

The 3G bandwidth limitation was imposed by Apple.  They never communicated the reason for it.

antipro

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Re: bandwidth
« Reply #4 on: March 11, 2011, 10:01:58 AM »
When you say it freezes, do you mean it locks up, or is it just jerky?

yea sorry, my english is not very good, for google translator "freeze" and "lock up" are the same word in my language. i try to explain better: when in full screen, sometimes the image has good fps but every second more less, it lock up for about 1 second.

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What are the specs of your computer (CPU, RAM, etc.)?  It's possible that resizing to the larger fullscreen image is requiring more processing.

it's a phenom 2 quad core, 610e model number, 4GB DDR2 800, ATI 5650.
the problem is not in the pc, is in the comunications between the software and the iphone.
it's normal to see those "lock ups" when the band used is 30kb(full screen) instead of 150kb(mosaic view).

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We have seen cases in the past where the framerate was slowed by third party software that had hijacked the JPEG encoding functions from the operating system.  Do you have any sort of image or video encoding software installed on your computer?  The encoding software that we've seen the problem with before was ffdshow and calibratedQ XD Decode, but there are probably other similar products that do the same thing.

yes i think i have more than one of those encoding sw,
surely i have ffdshow installed. uhm, i'll try to uninstall it and i try to reinstall icamsource again.

edit: i did it and nothing append, btw i am here if you want other informations

id like to know if others users have the same issue on local wifi or not.
(the issue is: high band used with mosaic, poor band used when just tap and set the image in full screen on the phone)
people where are you? help me please.


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The 3G bandwidth limitation was imposed by Apple.  They never communicated the reason for it.

thanks





« Last Edit: March 11, 2011, 01:31:33 PM by antipro »

Jay

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Re: bandwidth
« Reply #5 on: March 11, 2011, 04:59:56 PM »
If you have any other kind of video/image encoding software, try disabling it temporarily to see if it has any effect.

Also, is your iPhone jailbroken?

antipro

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Re: bandwidth
« Reply #6 on: March 11, 2011, 05:28:08 PM »
If you have any other kind of video/image encoding software, try disabling it temporarily to see if it has any effect.

Also, is your iPhone jailbroken?

where do i see the list of encoding sw installed? (btw imho is not a codec issue, i use similar softwares, of course you know "Yawcam" and others without any problems)

the iphone has been recently jailbroken, but the app has been bought.
honestly i bought it cause the one hacked wasnt working at all.
« Last Edit: March 11, 2011, 05:31:30 PM by antipro »

Jay

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Re: bandwidth
« Reply #7 on: March 12, 2011, 01:25:35 AM »
Unfortunately, there isn't any list where you can see what image encoding software you have installed (not that I know of anyway).

I'm not sure what is causing the behavior you're seeing, which is why I'm asking about the image encoding and the jailbreak.  Those are both things that have caused framerate issues in the past.  Unfortunately, the bandwidth usage by itself doesn't indicate what the cause is, so we need more info to narrow it down. 

You said that it freezes for about a second.  How often does that occur?

You may be right about the image encoding, but I'm not sure that a program like Yawcam would even be encoding any images.  iCamSource resizes the images before they're sent to the phone, which is why it needs to use the image encoding functionality included in Windows.  Sometimes, third-party software hijacks the image encoding functionality from the operating system.  We have seen a few instances in the past where third-party image encoding caused issues similar to this.

Also, do you have access to an iPhone/iPod/iPad that isn't jailbroken?  If you were able to test with a non-jailbroken device, that would rule out jailbroken software as a possible cause.

antipro

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Re: bandwidth
« Reply #8 on: March 12, 2011, 10:37:35 AM »
Unfortunately, there isn't any list where you can see what image encoding software you have installed (not that I know of anyway).

ok, btw i tried with onother pc, the one i use for gaming, it has not any econding software installed:
same behavior

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I'm not sure what is causing the behavior you're seeing, which is why I'm asking about the image encoding and the jailbreak.  Those are both things that have caused framerate issues in the past.  Unfortunately, the bandwidth usage by itself doesn't indicate what the cause is, so we need more info to narrow it down. 

well, i will post again when i will upgrade to the firmware 4.3


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You said that it freezes for about a second.  How often does that occur?

it occour everytime, always.
each second more less it freezes.
For half second or less, the images are fluids.

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You may be right about the image encoding, but I'm not sure that a program like Yawcam would even be encoding any images.  iCamSource resizes the images before they're sent to the phone, which is why it needs to use the image encoding functionality included in Windows.  Sometimes, third-party software hijacks the image encoding functionality from the operating system.  We have seen a few instances in the past where third-party image encoding caused issues similar to this.

ok, tell me some 3rd party sw you found. so i can search for the same or similars into my pc.

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Also, do you have access to an iPhone/iPod/iPad that isn't jailbroken?  If you were able to test with a non-jailbroken device, that would rule out jailbroken software as a possible cause.

yes I have access to another iphone, but its not the same model, it's a 3gs and it has not icam installed.

i will use mine to test it just when i upgrade to the new firmware and with no jb.

last things: when you swap between mosaic and fullscreen, what append to your upload band?
it remain at the same value? fps remain the same?
does a log file of icamsource exist somewhere?

see you

Jay

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Re: bandwidth
« Reply #9 on: March 12, 2011, 04:47:18 PM »
Just to clarify, you're seeing fluid frames for 1/2 second, then it pauses for a second, then is fluid for 1/2 second, over and over.  Is that correct?

Do you see this same behavior if you connect your phone to a remote Wi-Fi network?  Approximately what framerate do you see when the phone is connected to a remote network?

The encoding software that we've seen the problem with before was ffdshow and calibratedQ XD Decode, but there are probably other similar products that do the same thing.

We haven't seen the behavior you're describing in our own testing.  There have been a few other users that have seen jerky images on the local Wi-Fi network, but so far, they've all appeared to be associated with 1) CPU speed, 2) available bandwidth, 3) Third Party image encoding software, and 4) jailbroken phones.  The vast majority of users with jailbroken phones don't experience this, so it's not just the fact that the phone is jailbroken.  There might be some jailbroken software that has some effect on the network  or image decoding functionality.

Also, iCamSource doesn't create a logfile.

antipro

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Re: bandwidth
« Reply #10 on: March 12, 2011, 08:53:57 PM »
i dont know, excluding the jb for the moment i want try to find the codec issue.

omg, i understood... there's another problem with my system and icam: the band and fps become low also when i point the webcam to a fast moving object, for example a TV screen instead of me in a room. why? my codec problem?

i also tried to connected 2 and 3 webcam at the same time.
 with 3 connected the cpu is about 80%. could be normal?


« Last Edit: March 12, 2011, 11:51:10 PM by antipro »

Jay

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Re: bandwidth
« Reply #11 on: March 13, 2011, 06:07:10 PM »
The CPU usage depends on several things.  If any of the cameras are IP cameras, then the camera settings, such as the resolution and the framerate could effect the CPU usage of iCamSource.  Also, the motion detection processing settings in iCamSource will effect the CPU usage.

What is the Brand/Model of your webcam(s)?

Is your computer connected to the router directly with an ethernet cable or through Wi-Fi?

Does disabling Motion Detection in iCamSource have any effect on the problem?

antipro

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Re: bandwidth
« Reply #12 on: March 14, 2011, 12:45:16 PM »
PCs are connected trough lan cable, not wifi.
i have 3 logitech webcam: 9000 pro, c250, e3500(removed).

Probably the e3500 is obsolete or not perfectly compatible with the last software.
i removed it from the system cause it need too much cpu to works, i dont know why.

Now, with only two webcams, the cpu utilization is about 30%, that is a good value.


The problems of low fps still here:

I watch the iphone and i see my self "smooth moving" (30 fps) from 2 webcams, bitmeter says 150kb/s upload.

Then i point one of the webcams or both to a TV and immediately i see trough bitmeter the upload is dropping a lot, i watch the iphone and i see very low fps and freezes.

Again, this time i point my self and i see a fast good looking mosaic, i touch the screen to zoom to one webcam in fullscreen and again i see myself with dropping upload band and fps+freezes.

all this while the cpu is always about 30/40%.

Motion Detection is disabled.
Router Upnp says 12000 and 12001 ports are opened.

« Last Edit: March 14, 2011, 12:47:56 PM by antipro »

Jay

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Re: bandwidth
« Reply #13 on: March 14, 2011, 08:13:32 PM »
If motion detection is disabled, then the only processing done by iCamSource is that it resizes the image from the webcam and then sends it to the phone.  That shouldn't be affected in any way by movement in front of the camera.

Have you tried changing the image quality slider in iCamSource (Better Frame Rate -> Better Image Quality)?  Does that have any effect on this behavior?

antipro

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Re: bandwidth
« Reply #14 on: March 14, 2011, 09:31:16 PM »
If motion detection is disabled, then the only processing done by iCamSource is that it resizes the image from the webcam and then sends it to the phone.  That shouldn't be affected in any way by movement in front of the camera.

Have you tried changing the image quality slider in iCamSource (Better Frame Rate -> Better Image Quality)?  Does that have any effect on this behavior?

Ok i understood.
yes i tried but is the same.